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I’m really excited about today’s episode because we do not have just the wife here today, but we have a couple, and this couple has been working hard for the last couple of years to change the dynamic in their marriage and their sexual relationship. Things have changed drastically for them, as you’ll hear a little bit about it in the episode, and they are now ready to take things to the next level. But they have a few questions and concerns. So let’s talk to Jen and Floyd.

Amanda: Welcome to the podcast Jen and Floyd. 

Jen: Hello. 

Floyd: Hello. 

Amanda: Hey. Tell me what you want coaching on today. 

Jen: So we’ve been with you for a couple years now. We’re kind of over the first hurdle of me being okay with sex and being, you know, liking it and enjoying learning to enjoy it. Now it’s just kind of adding more to it. Like the next step of a little bit of maybe bondage, that type of thing. And just making sure that I’m not, I don’t, uh, I don’t know how to explain it. I don’t want to do anything that’s not within my integrity.

Amanda: Okay. 

Jen: But I also want to push it a little bit more than we have been. So just making sure that, I’m very spiritual and I want to be in line with myself, with my integrity, but not, I don’t know how far to take it, and I’m kind of worried about how far he’s gonna take it, because he is like, let’s go, you know, let’s jump in, let’s run. 

 Amanda: Okay. Well, I think it’s important to think about what the next level is, right? Like you’ve worked really hard. I know that. I mean, I’ve been working with you not only as the wife but you as a couple as well for a couple of years now. So we’ve made a ton of progress that way. And we wanna take things to the next level, but we also have to understand that not everybody wants to do all the things that some people would consider next level. So that would be my first question for you. 

Is this something that you even want to engage in? 

Jen: Yes. 

Amanda: Okay. And why is that? 

Jen: Because I want to, I want to get out of vanilla. I want something more exciting and something new and different. 

Amanda: Okay. And not that vanilla can’t be exciting.

Jen: No. And we’re fine with vanilla. Yeah. 100%. I’m great staying in vanilla, but I’m kind of ready to see if adding something more to it would make it more exciting for us as a couple.

Amanda: Okay. Perfect. Great. Okay, Floyd, what questions do you have around it? 

Floyd: Just making sure, you know, the one thing I’ve learned through our process is I do have to slow down, and that’s really hard for me, but I’ve learned that and it’s made a huge difference. I’ve noticed a huge difference for both of us. The closeness, the intimacy has been incredible with me kind of slowing down and just saying, you know, all right, we’re good where we are. And yeah, wait for Jen to get comfortable. She’s willing to try and we’ve learned that over the last couple years to move forward.

And so my thing is not pushing her too much, but I do feel sometimes a little nudge helps her, but the nudge needs to be within her comfort. And, you know, as we’re talking about a little bit of maybe bondage, I mean, she brought it up. 

Amanda: Okay.

Floyd: You know, it’s been on my mind, but she’s, you know, she’s the one who brought it up. Other things we’ve talked about, she’s brought up, so I kind of, within conversations we’ll bring things up like on a road trip or something, but she’s brought them up kind of in the serious kind of conversation as far as between us.

We’ll be listening to a podcast and here’s something we’ll bring up. Well, what do you think about that? And, you know, in generalization we talk about it, talking of getting a space in the house for us. 

Amanda: Oh, you want a sex room, huh?

Floyd: She conned me into watching the show and, no, that wasn’t a mistake. She’s the one who, again, brought that up. 

Amanda: Awesome. So the show we’re referring to is How to Build a Sex Room on Netflix. A sex room can be beautiful and romantic, or it can be like a sex dungeon or anywhere in between. So finding what works for you as a couple is important.

Okay, Jen, so let’s talk about pushing yourself to the next level. When you think about moving into these things, what comes up for you? 

Jen: Excitement. I’m interested in it. My problem is actually doing it then. In my mind I can say, this is fine, this is good, but when it comes to actually physically doing it and taking that step forward, I hesitate.

Amanda: Tell me about the hesitation.

Jen: I worry that he’s going to take it too fast. That if I take one step, then he’s going to be like, okay, let’s go farther, even though I’m more comfortable now with saying, stop and he’ll stop. He’s proven that to me. It’s just 30 years of, you know, of it being a certain way, it still kind of comes up, so I’m learning to trust myself and trusting him in that way. 

There’s just a lot of excitement. There’s a lot of mystery around it. And there’s also a lot of unknown of how far we’re both gonna go. We both have said that, how far is this gonna take us? How far are we gonna get into this? 

Amanda: Okay, and what’s the answer to that? 

Jen: As far as we want to. We have to take those first steps to do it. 

Amanda: Right. So, it sounds like your brain is coming up with a lot of questions. 

Jen: Yeah.

Amanda: And the important thing to do is, rather than dwell on the questions, is to answer them because you have the answers to them. So your brain’s like, well, what if he wants to go too fast? How far are we gonna take this? And the thing with that is you need to answer your brain when you have those questions. That’s how you build trust with yourself and trust with your brain. So instead of spinning out in those questions, actually taking the time to thoughtfully think about them and answer the questions that your brain is posing. Because remember, your brain’s whole job is to keep you safe. Right?

Jen: Yes.

Amanda: But it doesn’t necessarily understand what that means for you. 

Jen: Yes, and I tend to overreact to things too.

Amanda: Have you guys implemented the stoplight system in your sexual relationship? 

Jen: Not necessarily a stoplight, it’s more of ‘enough’. Yeah, I can say enough…

Floyd: I would say we don’t necessarily say red light, green light, but we have our way of, you know, she knows, Wait. Nope. Stop, go. Probably to a point where I ask, Is this ok? I don’t wanna call it green light, red light, kind of the stoplight thing, but we do have it in the system. And like I said, you know, both of us now feel the trust from the training we’ve done with you and others for a couple years. I think it is the brain thing. 

Amanda: Okay. So I love the stoplight system because it’s more than just the stop and go. But it’s that yellow light that you can communicate or  Floyd you can ask, Okay, where are you? Am I green? Am I yellow? Am I going to red? Right? And when she’s at yellow, then you know that you need to slow down and back off, but not necessarily stop. 

So adding in just that extra little color or little wording, can help gauge where you’re going and when you’re going to reach your threshold rather than like he’s going full steam ahead and all of a sudden you’re like, stop. Like yellow, and then he knows that he needs to slow down and back off a little bit until you’re like, okay, I’m green. Let’s keep going. Right? 

Does that make sense? 

Jen: Yes. 

Floyd: Yeah. 

Amanda: How do you feel about that? 

Jen: I think that’ll help. 

Floyd: I think that will help because, like you say, the stop or go, I mean, it is kind of one or the other. And that’s kind of what happened, not a lot of times because we have gotten to the higher threshold, but even throughout the couple years, that’s kind of been some of the roadblocks as we’ve growing. You know, as we’ve going, just basically starting this has been like, what do you mean stop?

Amanda: Yes, yes. Okay. As you’re exploring these new avenues and these new ways of being with each other, sometimes it’s also helpful to communicate and set up parameters and boundaries ahead of time. So talk about and get agreement and consent from both parties.

Okay, we’re going to engage in this activity, whatever that is for you, and set out what that is going to look like. Now, a lot of couples are like, well, I don’t wanna do that because I want it to be more spontaneous and I wanna do what just feels good in the moment, and that’s great. But if you have a partner who is still gauging whether they’re comfortable or not yet, having it all laid out ahead of time and then following that plan can help her be more at ease during.

Jen: Yes. 

Amanda: Does that make sense? 

Jen: Yes. Absolutely. 

Floyd: Yes, and I think where we’re going, that makes a lot of sense. With with the activities we’re going towards. 

Amanda: Yes. Especially when it comes to like kink and bdsm, right? Having a very consensual relationship around everything, and I mean Floyd, you constantly checking in with her. Is this okay? Am I touching you? Okay. Green, green, right? It’s a constant communication.

And this is one of the things that I love about the Kink and BDSM community is because there are very strict parameters about what they’re going to engage in. They’re all laid out ahead of time, so both people know what they’re getting themselves into, right? But then they’re communicating the entire time about what it’s going to look like and like yellow means slow down, back off, and red means stop and there’s no questions asked.

Do you feel like, Jen, if you had that in place where you’re talking about what’s gonna happen ahead of time and that you implement the stoplight system and you’re communicating constantly, that that will help with some of your anxieties about it?

Jen: I think so. Yeah. Because the communication is big. Being able to talk and being, I do like the yellow now sitting here thinking about it because then it gets him to realize, oh, I do need to slow down. And it’s not just that, okay, we’re good now, we’re not. And then you’ve gone to that point of, well, now what about me? I’m over to hill here. You know? 

Amanda: Right. And what I want you to think about too is what you wanna focus on is it being good for both of you? 

Floyd, I know that you have a tendency when she has hit breaks, to be like, Hey, well what about me cuz I’m already going, right? But really looking at it as not just a her and a you and you making sure you get yours and she making sure you get hers, but what is it doing to the relationship as a whole? So start thinking not just in terms of her and you, but as a marriage, as a couple, as a relationship. 

We call this thinking relationally. How is she doing in this part of it? Not just thinking about how I’m doing. Right? How are we doing as a couple as a whole together as we progress forward?

How does that sound?

Floyd: I think that’s what we’ve been doing well and working on, is the couple, the US. 

Amanda: Yes, yes. 

Floyd: You know, for a while that that was kind of the challenge was it was her or me or you know, or both of us getting ours. But we didn’t always come away us. I mean, that was for years my big thing. And on that part… 

Amanda: Well, and then that’s where the relationship gets more transactional instead of relational. 

Floyd: Right, right, right. 

Jen: Yes. 

Amanda: We want it to not be transactional. We want it to be relational. 

Floyd: And that’s where I want, you know, as we’ve talked, that’s where I say, you know, going to something different will bring that. And this is new for both, so this is also, I’m a little nervous. Excited, but nervous.

Amanda: Right? You both have the excitement, but the nervousness.

Floyd: But the nervousness, the area that I used to think, oh, that’s not for good people, because that’s how I’ve been raised, you know? With being in the Church, Christianity wise, that’s how we’ve been raised. And you know, as we’ve learned what we do in our doors, is what  we do in our doors, and as long as we’re good with it. I mean, I love that that you’ve taught. As long as we’re good with it and we’re good with it, with our God, then it is what it is.

Amanda: Right, and that’s where you guys getting to talk about it and laying out a plan ahead of time so that, Jen, you don’t have to worry about him going too fast or him doing something that you’re not okay with. But building that trust between you as you set out a plan together to think about what it’s going to look like and what you want for both of you, and then communicating and listening to each other as part of it. 

Jen: Yeah. Even just talking about this, to think that two years ago, I would never have, I was in no way.

Floyd: I’d be out the door right now.

Amanda: I know you guys really have come so far and I’m so proud of the progress that you’ve made. Being in vanillas totally fine. Doing outside vanilla is totally fine as long as it’s consensual between both of you. You’re both in agreement. You’re, you know, communicating with each other. As long as it’s within your integrity, between the two of you and your God, that’s all that matters, right?

Jen: Yeah. 

Amanda: A lot of people want to make things more exciting and make things, you know, take things to the next level by implementing kink and bondage and BDSM and different things. It’s a next level, but where I think it gets actually really much better for people is when we create deeper meaning within the sexual relationship.

Jen: Yes. 

Amanda: So even staying in the vanilla. Okay. Whether you’re in vanilla or you’re in kink and BDSM, right? What is the meanings that you are creating in your relationship and in your sexual relationship when you do these things? That’s when sex gets even better and deeper and more meaningful is the meanings that we give it.

So maybe the meanings that you’re creating from bondage is that you’re fully trusting each other. 

Jen: And that’s big for me because I have a hard time with trust. I have a really hard time with trust. So for me to be able to say to him, I fully trust you. In this, I mean, to be tied up is, that’s huge. Because I never…

Amanda: Never thought you’d be there. 

Jen: Never thought I’d be there. 

Floyd: And that’s huge for me because for the same reason is, you know, she’s shown me that trust. That I have to make sure, you know, I earn it, you know. 

Amanda: Absolutely. 

Floyd: As well as you know me. Yeah. And keeping me, you know, giving her that same trust.

Amanda: Absolutely. But that’s the beauty. 

Floyd: That’s what I want to build, is the trust…

Amanda: It’s the deeper meaning that you’re creating together by having that trust with each. That was not there a couple of years ago. 

Jen: It wasn’t, and I know the way I feel about him now is so deep that I can only imagine going, taking this a little bit farther, to where we’re both comfortable. Neither one of us knows how far we’re gonna get into it. We have no idea. So we’ll get into it…

Amanda: But you get to explore that together. 

Jen: Yeah, we get to explore it together, but I just think how much more committed and how deeper our love will be having that full 100% trust in each other.

Amanda: Yes. 

Floyd: I think that going here is more for that because we are in an amazing place. I’ve always loved her, but I was telling her the other day, it’s like I’m back to being a teenager and I gotta sneak outta the house at night to sneak down to her room. 

Amanda: That’s fun. 

Floyd: That’s how I feel about it, you know? But it’s cool to have that feeling now, knowing where we could go and I want those feelings to last forever, but whether we do or we don’t, or if it’s just a little bit of tie down, it’s okay. What I like is her willingness, which shows that she’s trusting and that she’s open.

Which then builds deeper with my emotional feelings towards her. Because, you know, for all those years, didn’t know what it was called, but I knew that was, you know, as we’ve learned through these processes, you know, I didn’t realize that’s what was called, was my emotional side. And that’s why every day I wanted it, because I really wasn’t getting emotional when there wasn’t the connection. It was transactional or duty sex or you know, and so it’s amazing to learn that through this process.That that’s what I really wanted. I just didn’t know how to say it or know what it was called.

But I wanted a connection. 

Amanda: Okay, so what’s still coming up? 

Jen: I don’t know. 

Floyd: I’m ready. 

Amanda: You’re always ready, Floyd. 

Jen: Yes. That is true.

Floyd:  But I want her, you know, I’m ready when she’s ready. That’s the big difference now. We talk about it. I think the 30 plus years we talk about and the brain, that’s still challenging, but she’s learned to go through that and stop that, that lower upper brain thing.

Jen: And I’ve learned that you can be sexual and be spiritual at the same time and actually can be more spiritual when you’re more sexual, you know? Which is a surprise to me. That was a big surprise. Going to your retreat, I was placed with a couple ladies in my room that I believe 100% I was not placed in that room by accident. I was placed with those two ladies to have me realize that you can be spiritual and sexual and be very sexual and be very spiritual. So I think that’s where it kind of came from, I left there going, wow, you know, I want to open this door. 

Amanda: So do you still have some hesitancy, some worry, some fear, anything like that? 

Jen: Um, I think the yellow light will help. 

Floyd: And the communication before. Setting expectations before will help both of us. Because then I know, okay, this is, you know, we’re gonna lightly tie our arms up. That’s all we’re gonna do today. If that’s, you know, as an example. That’s what we’re gonna do. You know, and we’ve actually kind of gone there, a little bit of, you know, kind of grabbed one of my ties and kind of wrapped her arms.

Amanda: 50 shades of gray all over. 

Floyd: But she can move, right? That is a big fear of hers, but it was just, you know, one of those moments that we were taking care of Jen and she didn’t bring the lights out, they stop or kind of awesome to watch actually as we continue through our intimacy, that time how she was acting and aroused and…

Jen: Well, and I had to put a blindfold on to get my mind, so I wouldn’t pay attention to the surroundings. I could just feel instead of, and I think that’s where I wanna go, is with a blindfold just for a little bit until I can get comfortable. My brain doesn’t see what’s going on. I can just totally dive back into my body. 

He was tickling me with a feather and I can hold tickles in like crazy and I could not, I could not hold that in, I was squirming everywhere because the sense is just intensified.

Amanda: Yes, yes. 

Jen: So I think that’s kind of where we’re going now is just the little bit. 

Amanda: You’ll get to decide what you wanna try that night, right? And or day. And you’ll lay it out ahead of time. You’ll communicate, you’ll use the stoplight system and you get to decide what that looks like at every single point.

So many times we’re like, well if I, you know, do this, it’s a slippery slope to this and I don’t wanna go here. And I think that that is a fallacy. I don’t think that that’s true, because you always have agency. Right? And if you have that trust with each other and are willing to listen and communicate with each other, then I think you can take it as far as you want.

Jen: Why are we taught that? There’s a slippery slope, when it comes to this? 

Amanda: Because we were taught by people who had a lot of fear and they thought that that was the best way to teach us. And they were doing their best too, even though it wasn’t great. 

Okay. Anything else you wanna address?

Floyd: I don’t know. I mean, that’s kind of where we’re going next, and we’ve kind of hit that ceiling. We’re ready to go through the glass ceiling, kind of. 

Amanda: I love it. So good. 

Floyd: You know, it’s amazing. I mean, truly amazing. I mean, you know, for anybody listening, you can get there. With its work and ups and downs. You know, to be where I’m at, I would never have thought it. You know, with what I knew three, four years ago, I would never have thought, you know, we could be here and this could happen.

Jen: And it wasn’t easy. It’s not, it definitely, that’s the hardest part is it’s not, it’s not cut and dry. It’s not just, okay, you do this, this happens. There’s so many ups and downs to it that I didn’t realize were gonna happen. I wasn’t prepared. 

Amanda: It’s work, but it’s work worth doing. Right?

Jen: It’s so much work, but it’s so worth it. Yeah. It’s so worth it. 

Floyd: And this is what we all dream for your marriage. You know, and it’s not just the more sex, it’s the intimacy, the emotional and, but it’s crazy how it’s hand in hand, you know, for both of us. You think, oh yeah, marriage is okay without a lot of it, but man, how great marriage is if you can be intimate. And it’s not just about the sexual acts, it’s the intimacy.

The emotional, being able to share things with Jen that I was scared to share and vice versa, you know? Same for her, I mean, we started doing this process and we’d start asking questions from the apps and the podcasts and start opening it up. And three years ago, I would’ve been scared to open up on any of the sexual talk, because she would kick me out and think I’m a deviant and I’m not spiritual. To go through it where both are willing to work and I really do believe that too. You know, great to have one working at it, but you gotta to get great, you gotta have both willing to work at it. But if they are, where you can go truly, if you’re truly working at it and being, you know, the high desire, fast moving guy, I mean, thought I knew all very confident person, it’s humbling though to be able to have to sit back and really realize your faults. 

Amanda: Yeah. 

Floyd: You know, and now that they’re bad, it’s just upbringing. 

Amanda: Yep, it’s the conditioning we’ve all got. But I’m so glad for where you guys are and how far you’ve come. Thank you so much for being here with me today.

Floyd: Yeah, no, we thank you. 

Jen: Thank you. Appreciate it. 

Okay. That was so fun to be with Jen and Floyd today. And as you can tell, they’ve come a long way and put in a lot of work individually and together. If you are ready to put in that work yourself, I am now taking applications for my men’s beta group. To learn more, you can go to amandalouder.com/men and of course, women can always join my Embrace You Elite Society.

That was so fun to be with both Jen and Floyd today.  As you can tell, they’ve come a long way and put in a lot of work individually and together.  This episode originally aired on my Embracing You Podcast, which is a subscription podcast where you can hear me coach women and couples, just like I did today, and learn how to apply the same things to yourself.  The Embracing You Podcast is just $99 for a year or if you are in my membership you can get it for $69/year.  Episodes air 3 times a month.

If you loved hearing Jen & Floyd today and how far they’ve come and are ready to put in that work yourself, I am now taking applications for my men’s beta group.  To learn more you can go to amandalouder.com/men and of course women can always join my Embrace You Elite Society. amandalouder.com/membership