In this episode, we are discussing a clothing optional resort. When I originally interviewed this couple, I did not know which resort they went to. I’ve since learned that not only is this a clothing optional resort, but also has options for public sexual activity. I want you to know that I am not endorsing this resort or their choices. For my full explanation, please listen to the bonus episode below before listening to the full episode.
I often get emails from listeners asking about how nudity and modesty work together. Now, I don’t have all of the answers, but in this episode, I speak with a couple who went to a clothing optional resort. We talked about why they chose to do it, what was surprising, what was not, and would they do it again. I also ask them the question, “How does this align with your integrity?” I loved their answer and you will too! I hope that this episode can spur you into thinking about things a little differently.
Amanda Louder: Hello everyone. Welcome back to the podcast. I’m really excited about today’s episode. It’s one I’ve been thinking about for quite a while now. After my conversation with Zach Spafford on Modesty, which is episode 237, I got a lot of emails about what modesty means for adults, and I really think that that is a question we each have to answer for ourselves.
There were also some questions about public nudity and does that align with our beliefs and value system as members of the church? So in response to those emails, one of which I will read during the episode, I reached out to a client of mine. She has been with me in some capacity for almost three years now. And I would say that she and her husband tend to be very sexually adventurous, and I knew that they had visited a nude resort, so I invited her and her husband on to the podcast for a conversation about that. They have chosen to stay anonymous, which I completely respect, so their names have been changed and I’ve also changed their voices. But I hope you find this interview as fascinating and interesting and helpful as I did. So let’s get to the interview.
Amanda: Okay. I am so excited to bring a couple on that I’ve known for quite a while. Brooke and Caleb, welcome to the podcast.
Brooke and Caleb: Thank you. Thank you.
Amanda: Okay, so we are bringing you guys on to talk a little bit about your experience at a nude resort. And now, first off, I really want to talk to you guys a little bit just about who you are, kind of just introduce yourself and let the audience know who you are.
Caleb: All right. We’re Caleb and Brooke. We’ve been married for 26 years. We have five children and definitely had some ups and downs and lots of struggles and challenges through those 26 years. But, it has been an awesome experience. We love each other. Glad to be in the place that we are today. And a lot of that can be attributed to you, Amanda, for the coaching that you have done.
Amanda: Well, thank you. Thank you. You guys I know have put in a lot of work yourselves. Do you want to say anything, Brooke?
Brooke: I think Caleb covered it well, and we are grateful to be here and excited to be able to share our story.
Amanda: Yeah. Awesome. Okay. So let’s talk about you guys going to a nude resort. Do you want to share where you went, maybe why you decided to go, how did you find out about this nude resort? Something like that?
Caleb: Yeah, I’ll start. It was something that we had talked about kind of off and on, I guess, throughout being married kind of as a joke, like, oh, that’d be fun and kind of laugh. And then a few years ago, I don’t know what brought it up, but we thought, let’s try that. And I asked Brooke if she’d be interested. She said, sure, let’s do it. And at that point we really had no idea where or what so we started doing research to see options of what would be available because we really had no idea.
So we started looking because we like to go to Mexico a lot and thought, well is there anything in that area that we could go? And so I started doing some research, found resort options. And then decided to start doing research looking at reviews, looking at things there, and we chose the one that we decided to go to just because it had more of a little bit, I guess, a sexier vibe. The other one was very much more of a naturist nudist.
And so we thought, well, let’s try this one and so that’s kind of how we decided to go to the one that we went to. We were already making a trip down and we thought, let’s just go check it out for a couple days.
Amanda: Fun. Okay, so you said that you talked about it quite a bit like throughout your married life, but I would love to know, like individually, why did you want to go? So, Brooke, do you want to start? Why did you want to go?
Brooke: I think I was just at a point in our relationship, where we wanted to, I guess try something new, see how it would go, I guess, where it was so new to us and not really knowing exactly what to expect. It was definitely an adventure. So I guess we were kind of looking at it that way, and I was in a solid place within myself at that point where I am like, I am willing to accept the responsibility for my choices in this. And so, that was kind of where I was with it at that point.
Amanda: Okay. What about you, Caleb?
Caleb: For me, I always have felt kind of at home or really more close to God in a sense, being naked out in nature, just, you know, in the mountains. I had lots of experiences, I guess camping, being able to do that. Never really at the ocean or the beach. And so it was always something I thought would be kind of fun to try. I heard about nude beaches, things like that. Thought it would be fun. I enjoyed being naked and so it was kind of one of those things that always wanted to try. Never had the opportunity. And so, we were kind of at that place and I asked Brooke if she was interested and she said yes, which I was actually kind of surprised about.
Amanda: Okay. So you were heading down to Mexico for a trip for the two of you anyway, and decided to just pop over to this nude resort for a little while. What was it like?
Caleb: One thing to kind of clarify, it’s actually considered a clothing optional. So there were people that wore clothes. You know, there was really no pressure, so some people did, some people were completely nude. So it’s really more of a clothing optional, which was kind of nice for us, or in that we had options. It didn’t have to be all naked .
Amanda: I think that’s an important distinction because sometimes, you know, if you were required to be, it might take a lot more, I don’t know, getting used to or something, but when you’re just seeing like maybe some people naked and some people just partially clothed or whatever, I think, you know, maybe that opens up a little bit more options.
Caleb: Yeah. One of the other resorts we looked at was the more naturist place was more of a required naked that way. So that kind of influenced our decision a little bit that way.
Amanda Okay. All right. So what was it like for both of you?
Brooke: So for me, when we first arrived, I was extremely nervous. A little bit of background for me. I came from a home where anybody seeing you naked was a very bad thing. And that actually made our early marriage actually a little bit difficult too. But, I had never, even after gym and I was on swim team, like when I showered, I still wore my swimsuit after swim team to shower. I was very much in that mindset, so this was going to be different. I had never skinny dipped.This was my first time attempting anything like this..
Amanda: That’s a big leap. That’s a big leap from going, like never doing anything to going clothing optional.
Brooke: Yeah. But when they’re checking you in at this particular resort, they had these rules that you read and agreed to, and it was all about being respectful of everyone. And, they put these stickers over our phones, so you can’t even take pictures. It helped me calm down some of those nerves in feeling a lot more safe and secure and stuff, but, I will tell you, I was the first one completely nude
Amanda: And knowing you, that doesn’t surprise me at all.
Caleb: No, I was surprised.
Brooke: I just figured I’m going to go for it like this. We’re here to see if this is going to be a good thing or not. And I’m going to try it and so, I had coverups that I wore like to and from the room. But when I was laying down on my chair or, you know, in the pool or hot tub, I took the cover up off.
Amanda: Did you eat naked?
Brooke: No. No, at this resort, it’s actually not permitted. You go to the events dressed, you go to the shows dressed, you go to dinner and lunch and stuff. All the restaurants dressed.
Amanda: Okay. I’m just asking all the questions that I have that I know the other people are going to be very curious about.
Brooke: Totally fine.
Caleb: You know, you can order meals by the pool and stuff like that and they’ll bring to you that food and you obviously don’t have to be clothed for that. But any of the restaurants, things like that, you do have to be. In this case, the women have to have a coverup. It can show pretty much anything, but the men have to be in their shorts and t-shirts.
Amanda: Okay. Anything else you want to add, Brooke?
Brooke: That was all right.
Amanda: What about you, Caleb?
Caleb: You know, in my experience, I was nervous, although it always sounded fun and all of a sudden here we were for real. I was very nervous and I was actually quite surprised that Brooke just took her clothes off and said, let’s go. And I was still hesitant about doing this for real myself. But, it was a fun experience. We went out by the pool. We didn’t know anybody, so that was kind of a little nerve wracking, not knowing anybody, knowing what to expect, but –
Amanda: Do you think you would’ve liked to have known somebody there?
Caleb: You know, in that case, no, because it was like, you know, we went in going, you know, we don’t know anybody. It’s kind of, you know, we can kind of hide a little bit that way.
Caleb: But it was refreshing really, honestly how friendly people were. Just because you didn’t feel a judgment, and you know, having been to other resorts many times, you know, people are just kind of standoffish. They are just to themselves, where here people were just friendly and, I don’t know if it was obvious that we were newbies, the look on our face, but people said, hi, you know, welcome, whatever. And it was just kind of a surprise that people seemed genuinely open, friendly, and really there was no judgment. So that was very refreshing to kind of have that feel.
Amanda: Nice. Okay. Well, is there anything that made you uncomfortable?
Brooke: No. I think after really realizing that no one was like, staring at us or judging us, it was just really easy to open up and be me. Like I felt like I could honestly just be me. And, so yeah, there was nothing that really made me feel uncomfortable after I hit that point of recognition.
Amanda: What about you, Caleb?
Caleb: No, no. I really didn’t feel uncomfortable once I got past the initial nervousness of the first taking off the clothes and being out among people. But no, it was very, very fun, enjoyable, friendly. People were super friendly.
Amanda: Brooke, did you feel the need to like suck in your stomach or, you know, like position yourself in certain ways or anything? Like, just because people would see, or did you feel like this is just who I am?
Brooke: Boy. I don’t remember trying to act or behave a certain way once, like I said, once we started to recognize that people were honestly being genuine and we could relax and be genuine. It was just easy to do that, just to relax and be who we were.
Amanda: That’s awesome. I wish we could be that way all the time.
Brooke: Right? No, that’s actually one of the things that was amazing about the experience was this recognition of like, when we wear clothes, we’re more judgmental of people and we are more guarded, but like, here we are in this resort and everyone’s open and friendly, but we’re not wearing anything.
Amanda: Cool. Well, I guess, so that kind of surprised you. Is there anything else that really surprised you?
Brooke: I think the other surprise actually took place when we went back. It was actually really kind of sad to leave. We went back to the other hotel because we went in between our break and it was really difficult to put clothes back on. And then this is where we noticed, like we hopped in the hot tub with people and here we’d had a couple of days of just total open conversation with people and it was like nail biting to try and get a conversation with people, and so that’s where I was just kind of shocked or surprised, like at the difference.
Amanda: Why do you think that is?
Caleb: I think, I mean, because we’ve had this conversation with people that were, while we were there at the resort, and it just seems like, you know, when you get down with no clothes and you’re naked, you’re pretty vulnerable. I mean, you’re pretty exposed. And I don’t know that everybody could do that. I mean, it takes some self-confidence and some internal vulnerability to be able to get to that point, I think. And so I think for me, my realization was that people were at a point where they’re totally open and vulnerable. They’re not trying to hide behind something or be somebody that they’re not. And so they’re just kind of more open. They’re more true, more vulnerable. That was kind of my experience as I talked with others about it because they had realized the same thing, but you’re open, naked, vulnerable, you have nothing to hide. And there’s all kinds of bodies, you know, all body shapes, sizes, and people just seemed to be comfortable and confident of where they were. And that was refreshing. That didn’t matter what they looked like, or you know, size or whatever. It was just, they were confident in who they were and it didn’t matter.
Amanda: Oh, I love that so much. I so wish that we could be more like that. I think especially in, you know, America we tend to be a lot more judgmental about body size and not as accepting of ourselves and our own bodies, like, you know, go to Europe and people are on nude beaches all the time, and it’s just no big deal.
I mean, I remember taking a trip to the Caribbean and we were on a French Island, Martinique, and we went to the beach and there was a woman selling bathing suits there. And she would put on a bathing suit and parade up and down the beach and then take it off and put a different one on and parade up and down the beach, and she did this just over and over and over and like nobody was even phased by it. Except for probably me, you know, and this was a long time ago, so I mean probably, gosh, 14 ish years ago and you know, now I think I would be a lot less judgmental and a lot less phased by it.
But I noticed immediately how insecure I felt. And I think the next thing that I noticed was how insecure I felt in my relationship with my spouse, you know, looking at this woman and thinking things and you know, stuff. So I guess that would probably be my next question is did you have any fears about your spouse seeing other people naked and being attracted or turned on or anything?
Brooke: I didn’t. I think I was just at a place at that point where I’d finally become solid within myself and also more solid with even our own relationship that it really truly wasn’t a fear. And again, like as we first had those first experiences, realizing that, I mean, nobody’s doing that.
Brooke: Everyone is there to enjoy their nakedness but it’s not, everyone checking everyone else out.
Amanda: Yeah. What do you think, Caleb?
Caleb: Yeah, I kind of, I didn’t have any worries about it, only because I knew where Brooke was at. I was a little, you know, because we hadn’t experienced this before, I didn’t really know what Brooke’s thoughts would be about it, because I don’t remember if we talked about it or not really if she would be jealous that, you know, there were other naked women there. I didn’t have any concerns with her seeing other naked men, but I was a little bit, you know, maybe nervous or concerned, not just not knowing what she would think but we talked about it afterwards and you know, she was like, no, it didn’t really bother me. I wasn’t concerned and I don’t know if that was just the work she’d done or if it was just kind of the place we were at in our relationship.
Amanda: So you said that you were, Brooke, that you were feeling really, you know, confident in yourself and solid in yourself and in your relationship. Was that before you started working with me or after you started working with me?
Brooke: Oh, totally after.
Amanda: Okay. Okay. I wasn’t sure where it fit in the timeline, just based on, you know, the work that we’ve done.
Brooke: This was right after, just within a few months after we finished working together.
Brooke: And so yeah, I was on a high as far as like the best I’d ever felt about myself, the best I’d ever felt about our relationship.
Amanda: Okay, cool. Well that’s good to know. Okay, so I think I’m really curious about what you felt like this brought to your relationship. Like what did it add? What changes did you see in your relationship based on going to this resort?
Brooke: I think part of it was we were able, or at least I felt like, I mean, we were already open at that point with one another more than we had been in the past, but it really did open up because we were totally vulnerable, not just with ourselves, with others and so it, for me, it felt like we were experiencing a growth in closeness. There was definitely more, I want to say aero synergy involved as well. Like just this ability to be in nature and to be ourselves and to not be judged. Like it was marvelous. And so, yeah, we had spent quite a bit of time in the room too.
Amanda: Good to know.
Brooke: But it was fun. It was definitely an added spice. My biggest concern was, is this going to draw us closer together or drive us further apart? That was kind of what I wanted to find out. And it definitely drew us closer together. So, yeah.
Amanda: And what about you, Caleb?
Caleb: Yeah, for me, I think that it was a new adventure and Brooke definitely opened up more. I could see that she was more comfortable, more confident than I had ever seen her before, and so that brought us, for me, it brought us closer together. And it was different experiences.
There’s definitely the aero synergy there of being able to see her naked all the time and in an environment that we wouldn’t normally be able to do. You know, in the states or really anywhere, you know, you always have to be fearful. And so it was in an area where we could do it and be okay and just, it did bring us a closeness together that we were able to do. While we were there, I was talking to some other couples and they had just done, kind of a boudoir photo shoot. They were very open about it and it’s like, oh yeah, we’ll show you what we did and all that. And, so that was something that we looked forward to potentially being able to do, and so just new experiences that we hadn’t ever done before. And, I was able to be together on the same page.
Amanda: Awesome. So I want to read an email that I got that kind of prompted this podcast episode, and then I’ll ask you a question afterwards, but a listener wrote in and said, “Hi, Amanda. I’m interested in your perspective on something having listened to a few of your podcasts, particularly your recent one on modesty. This year we traveled with some friends to Europe. During this time we went to some German spas where the protocol in the sauna is no swimwear. They are fairly regular visitors to Orvis in Colorado. Clothing optional hot springs. So we aren’t new to this. Having done, having overcome that inhibition when, at our villa in Spain with our own pool, we also chose the no swimwear option. Personally, in a strange way, I found the social nudity almost a spiritual experience, that we could have that level of trust, openness, and vulnerability with these friends. They went with friends. I felt liberated and at one point, and at one with myself and with nature. There was some fascination in seeing the female friend naked, but there was absolutely no lust, arousal, or sexual desire towards her. Based on traditional understanding of modesty, any kind of social nudity would appear to be outside of LDS teachings, or is modesty simply being comfortable and appropriate in the situation you are in? Maybe it’s a little bit too out there, but also maybe an interesting topic for a podcast. Thank you.”
So that’s the email that kind of prompted this. And I’ve actually received a few messages like, okay, so you know, if we are LDS and we have certain beliefs on modesty, how would going to a nude beach or a nude resort fit in with that? And I don’t know that I necessarily have the answers, but the question that I would pose to the two of you, and again, this is no judgment, this is just me with questions and curiosity, how do you feel it fits in with your integrity??
Caleb: Being naked in nature, to me is kind of, there is a spiritual experience. There is a feeling of almost, I mean, I don’t know that saying one with God. Kind of in our form that we were created, and I’ve always felt that, and I never had words to put with it. I just knew that I enjoyed the feeling when I’d been out in the woods in the forest, you know, and had opportunities to do skinny dipping or, you know, be naked. That it was like, there’s just something different about it and it didn’t feel dirty or bad, and so I can relate to that and that was kind of one of those things, why I’ve always wanted to try it at the ocean, because I love the beach and the ocean and so, I think, and we talked about this, you know, how does this fit in there? Are we crossing the lines? And I took it as that, you know, nakedness isn’t bad, nakedness isn’t wrong. I think it’s what we do with it and our thoughts and how we see that. Obviously there might be certain experiences or situations where that line could be crossed. But we tried to really make sure that we would be keeping our covenants that we had made with each other and that we weren’t going to do things that would be inappropriate, or crossing that bounds. But just being naked and seeing other people naked in a social setting was something that we kind of wanted to try and see how it went having never done it, and it was fun, it was relaxing, and we made friends and were able to just communicate and converse with each other and in a friendly, open way, but wasn’t sexual by any means or crossing those bounds of the covenants that we’ve made with each other.
Amanda: I love that you said that it felt like a spiritual experience for you, and Brooke was shaking or nodding her head yes, that she felt the same way as you were speaking. And you know, I love that you talked about what lines you were not willing to cross before that. You know, it’s really important to have boundaries for yourself. Not just putting up boundaries for other people, but have boundaries for yourself so that you stay in alignment with your integrity. And I think it’s really great that you guys talked about that beforehand. Brooke, what would you add to that?
Brooke: I think one of the things that struck me, was that we had, and we had discussed this, you know, as Caleb had said beforehand, but, in the United States in particular, like when we talk about being naked and stuff, there’s so much more sexuality tied to it. And I think that that translates a lot at least from the 1950s forward, maybe even before that, in particular it became very hyper defined for modesty and what that entailed. And I actually struggled with, I said, you know, the first part of our marriage because of the way that I had been raised. And it actually caused a lot of struggle in my life prior to even being married. It wasn’t until about 14 years into marriage that I read a book that actually finally stated that like, God created my body and it’s good, it’s okay. And it’s crazy that it took that long for me to go really? And it was eye-opening. I ended up doing a lot of study and prayer at that point to realize that, oh my goodness, there’s really absolutely nothing wrong with our bodies. There has been the concern of sexuality, like being tied to it and, and all of that, but when you go outside the United States, like you said, like, in other countries, I’ve known of you know, wards having their ward parties at Nude Beaches.
Amanda: So funny. It’s so different from what we’re used to.
Brooke: It’s entirely like different than what we think of here. But, it wasn’t about the nudity, it was about the sexuality and so going into this for us, we had the discussion and it was really, truly for us about seeing if this would enhance our relationship, and bring goodness.
Amanda: I love that. I love that so much. And I think, you know, you both hit on some really key points that we tend to sexualize bodies here in the United States, but our bodies are beautiful and there’s nothing shameful about them. And it really often depends on our belief systems and the thoughts that we’re thinking. You know, I said this before, like, you know, sex by itself is not good or bad. It’s what we do with it that makes it good or bad. Our bodies, you know, I would say are actually good because they were created in God’s image, you know? But we can at the same time do things that aren’t good with our bodies. So much of it is how we’re thinking about it and what we are using our bodies for.
I was listening to a podcast recently with the BYU professor and therapist, Tammy Hill, and she’s written a fabulous new book called Replenish that I’m anxious to read. Haven’t read it yet, but she said something in this interview where she said, you know, we were given bodies to bless our lives here on earth.
And I think that is one of the things that we are going to have to report back to our Heavenly Parents on, you know, they say, did you enjoy your body? You know, tell me what you did in your body that was so great. And I loved thinking about that because so many times we don’t think well of our bodies and we shame our bodies and we do things in our bodies that don’t bring us happiness and joy, but we came to earth so we could have a body and we need to be able to use it to its full extent and be able to experience all of the different things that bodies can experience that we couldn’t experience as spirits before we came to this earth. So I think that’s a really, really key point that I love that you pointed out.
So I guess my final question would be, would you do it again? And would you recommend it to others?
Caleb: Yes, we definitely would do it again. In fact, we have been back three times. And our plans to go back again because it was something that brought goodness to us. We actually met some friends there that we’ve kind of kept in contact with and gone back with and had opportunities to kind of have spiritual experiences with them and be able to, you know, stand for the things that we believe and show that.
And so that was kind of a cool experience that you wouldn’t think I had a missionary experience at a clothing optional resort. But we’ve had multiple experiences with these couples that we met there, and so we definitely would go back.
From our experiences just things that we were able to experience and do. I think for me, would I recommend it to everybody? Yes and no. I mean, I think that somebody who is confident in who they are and being able to, you know, have that understanding of what it is, definitely.
Somebody who just wants to go experience it just to, for the looks or, you know, to do it, but maybe isn’t confident in themselves, I think it would be maybe more of a struggle or a challenge, if they weren’t solid in who they are, because of those experiences.
So it definitely would be something that, you know, depends on where they’re at. But yes, I think if you had the mindset and were willing to be open, I think it would be a great experience to be open, vulnerable and experience that.
Amanda: Brooke, do you have anything to add to that?
Brooke: Wow. He covered a lot. As far as recommending it to others, I think it’s something that individuals need to discuss with their spouses and decide for themselves. The decision needs to be one that you both feel right about, or at least both are willing to accept the responsibility for.
I guess I feel like it’s been a blessing for our family, for, well, for me and my husband, for Caleb and I, it’s been an opportunity to be able to see each other in a different light and also to just be closer. It brought us closer together. Does that do that for everyone that goes there? No. And so, I think it depends on where you are at and where you and your spouse are together. So I think it needs to be something if you’re considering it, that you do discuss and decide together, if it’s right for you and if it aligns with your own integrity and your own beliefs.
Amanda: I agree with that. I have a feeling just because I know my audience well, there’s going to be a lot of men who hear this and they’re going to be like, you know, come on, let’s do it. I think this would be so amazing and wives who are going to be like, whoa, hold on.
And if your wife is not on board, do not pressure her to go. Do not, or vice versa. If your husband is not on board, do not pressure him to go. It is not okay to pressure your spouse to do this. It has to be a mutual decision where both people are giving full consent with no repercussions.
Caleb: Absolutely. Yeah. And something to kind of work up to, which we didn’t do, but we kind of had some growth, but you know, like a local hot springs somewhere that, you know, you could do just being naked, out in nature, outdoors, skinny dipping in the pool somewhere where it’s private. You know, get that first initial experience of what that is. Because I think for a lot of people that’s just a start. That’s a beginning. That’s a good stepping stone.
Amanda: That’s a great idea. Just dip your toe in the water right. See if it’s something you want to do.
Caleb: Sometimes at the hot springs or different places like that, you may have other people that come in and they might be clothed, might be completely naked, but you kind of get a little taste of it and so you can kind of find out, can I handle this or not? Before going to a place where there might be a fair amount of people. The other thing about this resort, it was a couple’s only resort, so that made it nice too. We didn’t have to worry about it being singles or people hitting on you. Really, it was a couple’s only place
Amanda: – or a bunch of kids walking around.
Brooke: Correct. And because it was clothing optional, like I knew going in that at any point I could put my clothes on and I would still not be judged. So there was some more safety nets in that.
Amanda: I like that idea. All right. Well, thank you so much Caleb and Brooke for coming on and sharing your story. I’m sure it will be very enlightening and helpful for so many couples, and I really appreciate you guys being willing to do that.
Caleb: Thanks for the opportunity.
Amanda: All right. That was fun, right? I hope that you found that very informational and helpful and you know, maybe it spurs you to think about things a little bit differently, which is what we’re all about here on the podcast. If you have any questions for me about the podcast, feel free to reach out to me through email, email@example.com, or you can always DM me on social media.
I hope that you have a great week, and we’ll see you next time. Buh Bye.