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Amanda: Welcome to the podcast today Quinn. How can I help you today?

Quinn: Hi, thank you for having me. Um, so my husband and I have been married for almost six years. We have some small kids under 4 years old. And we try and have sex pretty regularly. Like at least once a week probably and if it was up to my husband we’d probably have it every day.

But I don’t know. I just feel like I don’t have the desire to have sex a lot and I know I’m busy all the time with little kids and I’m touched all the time and um I’m tired at night. So that’s why I really don’t want to do that. And I also feel like when we do have sex sometimes like I’ll be enjoying it, usually some time during the time and then something will happen and I just like clock out. I don’t know I’m just like okay I’m done like um, can we just be done?  I’m done trying to I don’t know. Yeah, so that happens while we’re having sex and anyway so I’m just wondering how to get over that and how to want to have sex with my husband and enjoy it and not shut off my um libido or whatever I don’t know so.

Amanda: Okay, so you said that you most of the time enjoy it. What does that mean for you?

Quinn: Um, that it feels good. We’re connecting. I don’t always orgasm like a lot of women probably it’s yeah, it’s not super often that I orgasm and so that’s kind of disappointing you know? 

Amanda: Yeah.

Quinn: Um, but I don’t know. I mean it’s nice when it feels good but then I just kind of shut off.

Amanda: Okay, um, do you know the difference between when you orgasm and when you don’t?

Quinn: Like how I’m feeling?

Amanda: Yeah or what’s happening in the experience. What ways do you normally orgasm? Do you orgasm through intercourse, do orgasm through manual stimulation, oral stimulation, a toy?

Quinn: Usually manual. It’s like very rare that it’s been like his penis or whatever. So um, yeah, usually manual stimulation.

Amanda: Yeah. Okay, and how long are you spending?

Quinn: Um, sometimes it’s like 30 minutes, maybe longer. I don’t know.

Amanda: Okay, that’s actually pretty normal for women to warm up to the point that they want to be touched and then get to the point of orgasming can be 45 to 60 minutes or more. That’s normal. Okay?

Quinn: And so at that point I’m like okay, it’s like really late and I’m like I’m done I’d rather just go to sleep.

Amanda: And as a mom with young kids, that’s pretty normal, right? Like you have been dealing with kids all day which is exhausting mentally, physically, like you’re just tired. And that makes a lot of sense why you don’t want to necessarily always spend 45 to 60 minutes or more on an orgasm that may or may not come. 

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: So you also said like something happens and then you just like clock out. Like what kind of things happen?

Quinn: Um, well it could be um, just maybe I’m starting to like feel a little bit dry or like sensitive. Um or I start thinking of something, my mind’s wandering and I start thinking about what I’m doing tomorrow, I don’t know. Um, yeah, it’s just my mind wanders and I know that I have a really hard time just focusing on what I’m doing and part of me, like I don’t know how to stay in the mindset I guess of having sex.

Amanda: Yeah, well and a lot of that is really normal too. As women we have so much on our plates that our mind is always going but the practice, are you familiar with mindfulness and what that means?

Quinn: Yeah I mean I don’t, I haven’t really done it.

Amanda: Yeah. So it’s really just a matter of practicing mindfulness. Like if you are expecting your brain to stay engaged the entire time, you’re always going to be disappointed. You should really expect it to wander. But when it wanders, mindfulness is about just noticing without judgment and then bringing it back to where you want it to be. So when you notice like oh yep there it goes again, alright, come back, alright, come back, come back, right? Just keep bringing it back.

Because it’ll never just like okay I’m in it the entire time. That’s just not the way that our brain works. Have you ever tried toys?

Quinn: Now we haven’t.

Amanda: Why?

Quinn: Um, there’s probably just like a stigma around it. We haven’t really…I guess I’d feel like stupid going to store to get one too.

Amanda: You can get them online. You don’t have to go into a store.

Quinn: I know. Um, and then there’s the feeling of like it should work the other way without a toy. Um.

Amanda: But should it?

Quinn: Yeah, probably not.

Amanda: Toys are really great, but I would suggest that you don’t always use them if you can just because when we start to orgasm one way, our brain’s like, Oh this is the way we orgasm and so we orgasm easier in that way and when we try to go back to other ways then it becomes harder and it can seem like it takes even longer,even though usually it doesn’t it’s just our great and not making the adjustment but it can still be a way for you to orgasm and have enjoyment out of your experience without it taking 45 to 60 minutes. It can just shorten up that time a lot.

So there’s not a problem with it and it’s not going to replace your husband. Like you can’t connect with a toy in the same way that you do with him. And he can be using it on you or you can be holding it making sure that you’re getting the stimulation where he is stimulating you in other areas, kissing, sucking, you know, whatever. Lots of different areas so that you’re still connecting even with the toy there. It’s just going to get you there usually a lot faster. So, do we have to use them? No, but it speeds things up.

Quinn: Okay.

Amanda: And if you do want to connect with him in this way but you are tired and you don’t have 45 to 60 minutes, it can be a great way for you to experience more consistent orgasms which will actually make you usually want sex more.

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: It’ll shorten it so you don’t have to stay up so late which will make it so you’re more likely to want to do it, right? And you’re gonna get more enjoyment out of it and more consistently. And there’s lots of options when it comes to toys. So I have some of my favorites on my website.

Like you can just shop and get it directly from me so you don’t have to go anywhere. You don’t have to go into a store but some of my favorites are on there. They are an investment. There’s cheaper ones out there. They just tend to not work as well or for as long. Like you can buy cheap ones and the quality isn’t as good. It’s not gonna last you long as long.

But if you can invest in some toys, the quality is going to be a lot higher and they’re going to last a lot longer. So you like replace a toy 4 or 5 times for the amount that you would spend on one of these right? So it’s worth the investment and it might actually help you have a better experience. What do you think about that?

Quinn: Okay, I’m open to trying it. Um I guess my husband and I just haven’t sat down and been like we should try this so…

Amanda: Yeah, but I’m sure you’re going to share with him about your experience today, I would hope, and you know maybe talk about some of the things that we talk about and that can be one of them. That you know if I don’t have to spend 45 to 60 minutes or thirty plus minutes and it can happen faster for us, I might be more likely to want to do it more or more often, right? And he would probably be on board with that I would guess.

Quinn: Yeah, probably, we’ll see.

Amanda: Right? A lot of times, it’s not that we don’t like sex. It’s not. It’s like it’s that we don’t like the sex that we’re having and so if you can actually like the sex that you’re having, then you’re going to want it more.

Quinn: Yeah, makes sense.

Amanda: So when you have you said you have it fairly regularly, usually at least once a week, although your husband could have it every day. Yeah? Why the once a week?

Quinn: Um I read somewhere that it’s like healthy for marriage to have sex like around once a week so in my mind I’m like okay has it been a week already?

Um, and I guess I want to help my husband you know feel… I want to show my appreciation for him too and that’s the way he…

Amanda: It’s something you do for him. 

Quinn: Yeah. 

Amanda: Why do you do it for him and not for you?

Quinn: Well because probably I know I’m not going to enjoy it, like I know that I have a small percentage of a chance to orgasm compared to him.

Amanda: But we’re gonna work on that right? If we get a toy, so what’s the next excuse?

Quinn: Um, just because I don’t find it necessary to survive. So I’m fine, not having it and um.

Amanda: It’s not necessary for him to have it to survive either. So if we look at like Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs, it’s not on the same level as food water air sleep.

But it is necessary for us to thrive. Do you want your marriage to exist or do you want your marriage to thrive? 

Quinn: I want it to thrive.

Amanda: That means you have to thrive too. You have to figure out why it’s for you and not just for your husband. So how could sex be for you?

Quinn: Um, well for one, it’s enjoyable and it relieves stress.

Amanda: Do you feel that way?

Quinn: Ah, that it’s enjoyable and it relieves stress? Um, yeah I think so when I am able to orgasm.

Amanda: Okay. What else?

Quinn: What else? Um.

Amanda: It’s enjoyable. It releases stress. How else can it be for you?

Quinn: Um I can feel more connected to my husband. Um and I can’t think of any other reasons. I’m sure there are other reasons but right now I can’t think of any. 

Amanda: Yeah, that’s okay, but that’s really what when you’re like, well I guess I should do it for him at least once a week. I really want you to focus on why you want it for yourself too.

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: I mean, sure he’s going to love it and enjoy it. But if you’re doing it just for him, it’s gonna become a problem.

Quinn: Yeah, and I don’t like having duty sex or whatever.

Amanda: You should never have duty sex ever.

Like sex needs to be for you and for him and for the both of you to help yourself and your marriage thrive. So if you’re doing it just for him you’re probably not looking at how it can be for you and it’s not going to be as fulfilling for you either. 

Quinn: Yeah, for sure.

Amanda: You said that you don’t have a lot of desire for it. Tell me about that.

Quinn: Um, it’s kind of what I’ve said earlier. I just don’t feel like I need it like he does. 

Amanda: He doesn’t need it either. 

Quinn: Um, okay I guess I don’t want it like he does. I just think a lot of it stems from the fact that it just is really time consuming and it’s uncomfortable sometimes um, yeah.

Amanda: Uncomfortable how? Just like when you get dry? 

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: Do you use lube?

Quinn: We do. 

Amanda: What kind of lube are you using? 

Quinn: Um I can’t remember the brand. I think it’s like platinum or something.

Amanda: From the grocery store? 

Quinn: Yeah, probably. 

Amanda: Okay, so that’s part of your problem. You should be using Lube most of the time and don’t use anything from the grocery store. Most of that stuff is full of toxic chemicals that actually aren’t good for your body.

So I have an episode on my Sex for Saints podcast, number 96, that’s all about lube and gives you some examples of why the toxic stuff that’s in them…so the FDA regulates lube as a device instead of a topical. So companies can basically put whatever they want in it and a lot of those cause a lot of problems and so you want something that’s a lot more natural and organic for your body.

Quinn: Okay.

Amanda: Like anything you put on or in your body, you want it to be healthy. Most of them aren’t and they can actually cause more problems than help. So make sure you’re getting a good lube and use it every time and if it’s drying out, you’ll want to use a different kind of like if you’re using water-based, which will dry out after a while, you probably want to use something either, if you’re not using condoms, you can use something oil-based. If you are using condoms then I would go to silicone. So Uber Lube is my favorite silicone lube. Coconu makes a really great oil-based lube.

Quinn: Okay. 

Amanda: Those are my favorites. And those are really healthy and good for your body and they’re gonna last a lot longer than a water based so then don’t get that discomfort. Does that make sense?

Quinn: Okay, yeah.

Amanda: So the time that it takes, it’s uncomfortable. What else? We’re gonna eliminate the time stuff with the toy. We can eliminate the discomfort with some different lube. What else?

Quinn: Um, ah I am not sure.

Amanda: You said when you wrote in that there would be less tension and you wouldn’t have to dread or find excuses for not wanting to have sex.

Quinn: Um, yeah, so I guess I just feel like a lot of it is, well okay, so there’s tension there because he knows that he’s not like meeting my needs and wants all the time. And so he kind of feels bad about that. Um, and I probably do have some resentment um because I’m not always getting my needs met and um.

Amanda: As far as like enjoying it and orgasms? Is that we mean?

Quinn: Yeah

Amanda: Okay. 

Quinn: Um, and then there’s like the aspect of…I mean okay, I’m not wanting it as often as he does but I know he wants it more often and so I just feel tension there.

Amanda: Yeah, is it tension, is he saying things, is he doing things or are you just mapping? 

Quinn: What do you mean by mapping?

Amanda: Like because we know our spouses really well and we read them like a book whether they say anything or not. So like body language, the tone of voice? Like we can just tell, we map our spouse.

Quinn: Yeah, it’s probably mapping. Um, yeah, I’ve had to tell him like hey, just like ask for it, okay, if you really want it. Stop trying to hint or whatever that you want it. I would rather have you ask me than start trying to turn me on and whatever. Um, so but a lot of it is mapping.

Amanda: What changes in him? What do you notice?

Quinn: Sometimes he’s like kind of on the pouty side because it’s been a while and so that’s like I really don’t want to have it because I know you want it. But you’re pouting like your dog.

Amanda: But pouting is not attractive. Okay, what else?

Quinn: Sometimes I mean a lot he’ll try to be more physical with me and I’m fine cuddling but I don’t always want everything to lead to sex. And so that’s hard for me because I feel like if he tries to cuddle with me or you know tries to be physical and show affection and like okay, he probably just wants sex and I mean obviously he does because he’s a guy and 

Amanda: Maybe.

Quinn: But more than likely.

Amanda: But like he could just want to cuddle to maybe hopefully lead to sex but he would be okay if it not and that’s part of the conditioning that we have as women is we think he always wants sex. What do you think sex is about for him?

Quinn: Um, I know that he wants to connect with me and he wants to show that he loves me and he does like when we are having sex he does really try and help me enjoy it and I appreciate that and um, so he’s really sweet and everything but I mean it does feel nice and it relieves stress for him and I see that it helps him. He seems like more motivated the next day or something.

Amanda: That’s true. It’s true, but a lot of that is what we interpret as he just wants sex is he really wants to connect with you in the deepest way that he knows how. In a way that he can’t connect with anyone else.

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: And we just go, Oh he’s just a horn dog and he wants sex all the time and like what we have to switch our mindset on he actually wants me. He wants to connect with me in a way that he can’t with anyone else. Is that what I want too? Do I want to connect with him in a way that I can’t with anyone else? 

You can talk to girlfriends and you can cuddle with your kids and stuff but sex, if you start to look at it like you mentioned at the beginning, like you’ve got a bunch of little kids which I totally get but they are extracting from you all day and if you feel like your husband is extracting from you too then of course you’re gonna feel touched out and you don’t want to be touched. 

But if you can start to see it as a way that he is nourishing you and giving to you rather than extracting from you, and a lot of that’s your mindset a lot of it might be how he’s showing up, right? But sounds like he’s trying to help you enjoy it seeing that as nourishing and giving rather than extracting. That can help switch things. How do you feel about that?

Quinn: I like that. I think mindset has a lot to do with everything and so I guess maybe if I’m just like thinking of that while we’re having sex or before whatever you know.

Amanda: Well and I think if you can start enjoying it more, if you maybe use some toys and stuff to speed things up and make your orgasms come more consistently, then it’s going to be easier for you to want it more.

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: Right? Which is why it’s a good idea to incorporate some of these helpers and tools. Toys are just tools. Just tools to help you have a better experience and to help be able to connect more.

Quinn: Okay.

Amanda: Okay. And I think, um, he’s definitely got work to do on his end, so he’s not pouty. What women are attracted to is masculine strength. That’s what we’re attracted to. We’re not attracted to pouty. We’re not attracted to the men who, you know, feel entitled. Neither one of those are attractive. What we’re actually attracted to is strength, like I desire you I want you and if it’s not what you want, I will be okay.

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: If more men would come from that position, I think a lot more women would be attracted, right? And so the more you can stand up for what you want in the relationship and what you want from him, and let him know like if he’s being pouty and you start to map, you can see that shift, call him out on it. 

Not in a mean way. Like you know, I can tell that this is what you want and I can see that and you tend to get a little pouty and I’m just gonna be honest with you, that isn’t attractive to me and I want to be attracted to you and what I do find attractive is this. And kind of help him to see that. It can help to shift things as well, right? Sometimes we’re just like, Oh I have to make sure that he’s okay, and I have to take care of him. 

Well, you don’t want to mother him that’s not attracted either. We’re not supposed to be attracted to people we take care of, right? So if you’re having to take care of him, make sure his needs are met and that puts you in more of a parent role and him in a child role, and that’s not attractive. But part of that to you and then part of that’s him, and so you’ve got to switch your perspective and start standing up for an adult-adult relationship. What you actually want, what you find attractive. 

Okay, now you might not have a lot of desire ahead of time but sometimes, and we’re gonna hopefully make that more consistent with some toys, once you get going, you most of the time enjoy it. 

Quinn: Yeah. 

Amanda: Are you familiar with the term responsive desire?

Quinn: Um I haven’t heard that but makes sense.

Amanda: So most of the time, what we think about with desire is we think of this spontaneous desire that just like comes out of nowhere. The majority of men have a more spontaneous desire because they have testosterone coursing through their body which creates that physiological drive for connection and desire. Women don’t have that. Women have about a tenth the amount of testosterone that men do so we’re not gonna have that constant desire for it. But what most women have is a more responsive desire. 

So if we will work on our mindset, what we’re thinking about during the day. So yes I know while you are, you know, taking care of all these little kids, you’re like, I don’t even have time to think about brushing my teeth, let alone thinking about sex during the day right? But actually having to do it with intention, really thinking about fantasizing, imagining what you might want to happen that night.

Quinn: Okay.

Amanda: That’s going to help get your brain engaged earlier. And when your brain is there and then you start to get touched and start to get aroused, desire kicks in. So we think desire comes before arousal and for most women, it’s opposite of that. Arousal comes before desire. So knowing that then you can be willing to try more often. Like nope not feeling it but I’m willing to try. I’m willing to try, knowing that it will probably kick in and I’ll actually enjoy myself. Now if it doesn’t kick in, be honest with him about that. Like, it’s just not happening for me. I’m sorry. I’m done. And you can be done and take care of him if you want to or can be done and not. 

Quinn: Yeah.

Amanda: He will be okay if he doesn’t have an orgasm, right? So you get to decide what that looks like for you, but I always say willingness is the entry point, willingness is the key. Are you willing to try and be aroused? Are you willing to try to have that desire kick in and to have a connecting experience? Remember that you are being nourished through this, you are going to have more energy and more connection if you are willing to let yourself be nourished through your sexuality. How do you feel about that?

Quinn: I like those points. I think I’ll probably remember the mindset of being nourished a lot. I like that a lot. So I’ll work on that.

Amanda: Yeah, I mean you’re spending so much time, so much of your life right now, making sure that everyone else is being taken care of. What if this is your time to take care of?

Quinn: Yes.

Amanda: So rather than taking care of him, this is your time to be taken care of. I actually think that’s why God created women’s bodies that it takes us a lot longer to orgasm. I think that was by design because we spend so much of our life taking care of others, that sometimes we need to just sit back and relax and be taken care of.

Quinn: Yeah, it’s a good point.

Amanda: So it’s not a hindrance. It’s not a problem. I think it really is by design. If we will look at it from that perspective.

Quinn: Yeah, thank you. I like that.

Amanda: Okay, so as we wrap up here, I always like people to kind of just think about and say out loud what they’re gonna take away from our conversation. What are gonna take away from our conversation today Quinn?

Quinn: Um I think that it’s okay for us to try toys and use tools to help us. It’s okay that it takes a long time. And that I need to let myself be nourished and allow myself to feel loved and connected with.

Amanda: I love it. Well thank you for being here with me today.

Quinn: Well thank you for having me. I enjoyed it.

Amanda: I think this episode was so applicable for women. I hope that as you listened, that you can see how some of the things that you have been conditioned to believe or do, actually hinder your sexual experience. Just learning to tweak a few things, can make it more enjoyable.